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Netcat camera experiences? (ptz)

edited December 2015 in SecuritySpy
Found a reasonably inexpensive PTZ outdoor camera from a company called "netcat" on Amazon. 20x optical zoom, ptz, IR, 1080, and .005 LUX sensitivity. Current price $335 US (I'll find this post in a few years and laugh that I thought that was "cheap"!) and thinking of getting one or two for current uncovered areas. However, as with all Chinese cameras, I have no idea if it will work natively with SS including the pan/tilt and audio functions. Anyone have experience with these?

JT

Comments

  • Hi JT, it might work with one of SecuritySpy's built-in profiles, but I'd advise against it, simply because it hasn't been tested, and it may be difficult to determine which device profile to use (though we can advise you which ones to try first).

    It would be much better to go for an ONVIF-compatible camera - this way it is highly likely to work with SecuritySpy right out of the box.
  • Well, I went ahead and bought one without knowing enough. They're super-cheap, but the construction seems pretty solid and the picture is decent. Plus optical zoom. All for $214 USD including shipping. So it works, but there are caveats.

    It does seem to be ONVIF compatible. However, not _entirely_ ONVIF compatible, or there are offsets and motion elements that don't quite make sense. For instance, when I pan (or tilt, or focus) the action keeps going until it reaches a stop, or in the case of pan, it just keeps spinning the camera around. In order to stop it, I need to hit the opposite button (left/right) and that stops the panning. For tilt and focus, it just keeps going in whatever direction button was hit last UNLESS I hit left/right which then spins in that direction and then I have to hit the opposite pan button to get it all to stop (whew!)

    However, when I use the included CMS software (an .exe file for Windows) and use their controls, it behaves quite nicely - each click of the left/right onscreen button does the right thing, focus works, PTZ works, the lot. I fired up a packet sniffer and watched what the CMS software sends and it seems to look like parse-able commands (here's a "pan right one increment" button press):

    0000 ff 00 00 00 04 00 00 00 00 00 00 00 00 00 78 05 ..............x.
    0010 48 01 00 00 7b 20 22 4e 61 6d 65 22 20 3a 20 22 H...{ "Name" : "
    0020 4f 50 50 54 5a 43 6f 6e 74 72 6f 6c 22 2c 20 22 OPPTZControl", "
    0030 4f 50 50 54 5a 43 6f 6e 74 72 6f 6c 22 20 3a 20 OPPTZControl" :
    0040 7b 20 22 43 6f 6d 6d 61 6e 64 22 20 3a 20 22 44 { "Command" : "D
    0050 69 72 65 63 74 69 6f 6e 52 69 67 68 74 22 2c 20 irectionRight",
    0060 22 50 61 72 61 6d 65 74 65 72 22 20 3a 20 7b 20 "Parameter" : {
    0070 22 41 55 58 22 20 3a 20 7b 20 22 4e 75 6d 62 65 "AUX" : { "Numbe
    0080 72 22 20 3a 20 30 2c 20 22 53 74 61 74 75 73 22 r" : 0, "Status"
    0090 20 3a 20 22 4f 6e 22 20 7d 2c 20 22 43 68 61 6e : "On" }, "Chan
    00a0 6e 65 6c 22 20 3a 20 30 2c 20 22 4d 65 6e 75 4f nel" : 0, "MenuO
    00b0 70 74 73 22 20 3a 20 22 45 6e 74 65 72 22 2c 20 pts" : "Enter",
    00c0 22 50 4f 49 4e 54 22 20 3a 20 7b 20 22 62 6f 74 "POINT" : { "bot
    00d0 74 6f 6d 22 20 3a 20 30 2c 20 22 6c 65 66 74 22 tom" : 0, "left"
    00e0 20 3a 20 30 2c 20 22 72 69 67 68 74 22 20 3a 20 : 0, "right" :
    00f0 30 2c 20 22 74 6f 70 22 20 3a 20 30 20 7d 2c 20 0, "top" : 0 },
    0100 22 50 61 74 74 65 72 6e 22 20 3a 20 22 53 65 74 "Pattern" : "Set
    0110 42 65 67 69 6e 22 2c 20 22 50 72 65 73 65 74 22 Begin", "Preset"
    0120 20 3a 20 36 35 35 33 35 2c 20 22 53 74 65 70 22 : 65535, "Step"
    0130 20 3a 20 35 2c 20 22 54 6f 75 72 22 20 3a 20 30 : 5, "Tour" : 0
    0140 20 7d 20 7d 2c 20 22 53 65 73 73 69 6f 6e 49 44 } }, "SessionID
    0150 22 20 3a 20 22 30 78 34 22 20 7d 0a " : "0x4" }.

    I can easily take a sample of each type of movement command that the CMS sends and get it to you, Ben. Or I could do the usual thing and let you log in remotely on the SS mac, but that doesn't get you access to the packet traces from the CMS which is running on a different system entirely, but I could probably get you access to that, too. Or just map the whole camera to a public IP address and let you have at it.
  • Well, this is now a trend. While at CES I grabbed an Amcrest IP camera, and it shows exactly the same behaviors - an arrow key causes the camera to move in that direction (l/r/u/d) but it does not stop moving, no matter what. Hitting the space bar returns to home position.

    Two cameras having this same symptom in a row is a bit strange. This is on 3.4.8b2.
  • Hi John, if you can use Wireshark to capture the ONVIF request that the camera's own software sends to it, that would be very useful and may help us debug the problem.

    Meanwhile I've made a few tweaks to SecuritySpy's ONVIF PTZ commands and I've sent you an email to a beta version you can test to see if there is any improvement.
  • Update: There is now an operational "Amcrest" camera profile as of 3.4.9 - great news! Works fine, audio and video.

    However, the Netcat camera still doesn't work with the ONVIF setting. Any motion direction or zoom causes a continuous movement until the end of the range, unless a left/right key is hit to stop the motion of the opposite direction - same as before.
  • Also worth noting with this camera: the stream will work for a few hours, and then will fail. SS will not successfully re-connect. The other cameras work well. I get a "Communication Error" response on the Netcat window. If I quit SS and restart it, it connects on the first try. So this does not seem to be a camera problem; it seems to be an SS problem with reconnection.
  • Hi JT - if you are able to put the netcat camera online we'll take a look to see if we can find out what is going wrong with the "stop" PTZ command. The Amcrest one is working fine now so you can take that down. As for the connection error, please also attach SecuritySpy's error log log to your email.
  • edited March 2016
    Update: the Netcat camera is now working in a beta version of SS (thanks, Ben!) for pan, tilt, and zoom. The pre-set positions don't work yet, but at least the camera is now moving!
  • Finally got back around to getting this camera running with 4.0.4. I'm still having the same problems - pan, tilt, zoom are all a bit "odd" meaning that they move far too much for each one "click", sometimes unbidden to their stops (or spinning forever with pan.)

    But now using the camera outside in a temporary setup - very impressive video quality even if the software is a bit sketchy. 20x optical zoom with a "spotlight" IR illuminator that comes on after a certain zoom level, which is like a floodlight. I can count the teeth on the deer sitting on my lawn (pitch black) at around 110' (33m) away.

    As usual, I can put this on a public port if you (Ben) want to play with it.
  • Hi JT, the best thing to debug this would be to use a packet sniffer application - the easiest one to use is HTTP Scoop.

    Using this, you can see exactly what commands SecuritySpy is sending to the camera when you use the PTZ controls in SecuritySpy.

    When the camera doesn't stop when it should, check what has been sent by SecuritySpy. If you see that SecuritySpy has in fact sent a "stop" command when you lift your finger off the button, then it's the camera's fault and there won't be much we can do about it. If you don't see a "stop" command being issued, then it may be SecuritySpy's fault and we'll have to investigate further.
  • I've looked more at the protocols on this camera. There is one set of what appears to be proprietary protocols (I'd sent a pcap file a while back on this) but they also kinda sorta understand ONVIF. What appears to be the case is that the step functions for each move command are much, much too large. I don't know enough about ONVIF - is there a "speed" or "increment" modifier that can be sent with commands? If so, being able to change that with the slider (greyed out) on the PTZ window would be helpful, otherwise the proprietary protocol would need to be reverse-engineered (it's just ASCII) or obtained from the manufacturer for this camera to work at any acceptable value.
  • @jtodd, is the link below the camera you purchased? It's got some pretty solid reviews and looks like a good deal! Are you happy with it so far?

    https://www.amazon.com/NETCAT-Outdoor-Optical-1080P-Camera/dp/B011R609QU/ref=sr_1_2?ie=UTF8&qid=1471612593&sr=8-2&keywords=netcat+20x#customerReviews
  • Yes, that's the camera. Working well, even still, from a hardware perspective (after 1+ months of being rained on) but the software is still garbage. SSpy doesn't work well with it - the ONVIF motion stop events aren't being caught as I note above, or are competely over/under compensated, so the camera isn't really a PTZ in a useful sense. I can aim the camera with the Windows app just fine, but then if I try to move it with SSpy it just falls apart. This is probably an ONVIF implementation error on the camera's part, and the seller is entirely unresponsive and there are no software updates visible anywhere for it. I strongly suspect this was one of the camera types that was also part of a recent DDoS attack bot army (Oct 21) due to the terrible firmware for cameras that had public IP addresses. So in short: yes, it's a nice piece of hardware almost entirely ruined by bad firmware with no support. SSpy almost kinda sorta works for control, but not really. If you're looking for an outdoor camera with a great image, fantastic IR spotlights, and which is only slightly easier to move around than a fixed dome, then this would be a good choice. If you're looking for a real PTZ, look elsewhere.
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